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but it's also important to remember that the fiscal cliff isn't only tax rates and spending cuts. the fiscal cliff also includes the nation's agriculture policy, which expires at the end of the year. it includes patches to medicare formulas. patches to social security formulas. so this is a huge mess of issues. we're not even talking about those issues yet. congressional negotiators and the white house aren't talking about these huge host of other issues that are on the table. the thought is if they can get past tax rates and spending cuts, then they will be able to deal with the peripheral issues. but we don't have much time. if a deal isn't reached or a framework isn't reached in the next week or, so it's going to be a big problem. >> all right, thanks for that. good to see you. > >>> nokia -- we'll tell you more when we come back in a few moments. [ male announcer ] this december, remember -- ♪ you can stay in and like something... ♪ [ car alarm deactivates ] ♪ ...or you can get out there with your family and actually like something. ♪ the lexus december to remember sal
but it's also important to remember that the fiscal cliff isn't only tax rates and spending cuts. the fiscal cliff also includes the nation's agriculture policy, which expires at the end of the year. it includes patches to medicare formulas. patches to social security formulas. so this is a huge mess of issues. we're not even talking about those issues yet. congressional negotiators and the white house aren't talking about these huge host of other issues that are on the table. the thought is if...
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comment on the fiscal cliff. headline -- john boehner calling the white house's most recent offer not a serious proposal reiterating the fact that is he willing to put revenues on the table but not through a raise in the tax rates, by closing loopholes. he wants lower tax rates. reiterating the republican position there. harold ford jr., the former democratic congressman, also doug holtz-eakin is the former congressional budget office director. keith banks is here with us as well. harold, your reaction to what the house speaker says here? certainly doesn't seem, if you listen to either the president or the speaker, that we're any closer to a deal. >> i was encouraged by the speaker's remarks. he didn't put his foot down and say no adamantly or irretrievably to anything. whether asked specifically if rate increases were something he could support, he suggested that there were other means and other ways to achieve new revenue. a lot of ways i thought it was a measured response and we live to fight. those of us who
comment on the fiscal cliff. headline -- john boehner calling the white house's most recent offer not a serious proposal reiterating the fact that is he willing to put revenues on the table but not through a raise in the tax rates, by closing loopholes. he wants lower tax rates. reiterating the republican position there. harold ford jr., the former democratic congressman, also doug holtz-eakin is the former congressional budget office director. keith banks is here with us as well. harold, your...
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. >>> what are the long term effects for business travel if the economy falls off the fiscal cliff? the gbta predicts the reduced deficits and lower interest rates will lead to growth in the economy and an increase in business travel spending. >>> welcome back. now to the weather channel. reynolds wolf is standing by. what is happening around the country today? >> the story is all west. everything is taking place out west. rain, some strong winds, even some snow. some places snow getting up to around 2, 3 feet, but that is high elevation. but for the eastern seaboard, pretty quiet p. temperatures very mild this time of year. when you get into the center of the u.s., still fairly mild conditions. a bit cooler as you might imagine in spots up like towards the twin cities and even over towards chicago. but then out west, that's where the trouble really brews. it's that time of year that there's norm lay big area of high pressure that sets up off the west coast. that's gone and that allows all the pacific moisture to come through. high snow will be an issue. rain in seattle. so how is i
. >>> what are the long term effects for business travel if the economy falls off the fiscal cliff? the gbta predicts the reduced deficits and lower interest rates will lead to growth in the economy and an increase in business travel spending. >>> welcome back. now to the weather channel. reynolds wolf is standing by. what is happening around the country today? >> the story is all west. everything is taking place out west. rain, some strong winds, even some snow. some...
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he doesn't say maybe if we can't get a deal together, maybe we'd be okay with the fiscal cliff. he says that is the best deal for everyone, the best deal for progressives, just to do it. to go back to the clinton era rates. you get rid of three quarters of the deficit just on tax increases at that point. >> and he says you get defense cuts. >> you can't get defense cuts any other way. and he's not the only one. there's a lot of people on the left and there's quite a few people on the right. i'm glad you're optimistic and a lot of ceos and guys in your position -- if you run a company, you don't need consumers petrified and business people petrified. this is the last thing we need if you run a company. i understand you have a horse in the game. >> but you also have the double trigger. if you go over the cliff, we've got the debt ceiling fight right afterwards. it's not like that's six months down the line. that's in if first month, six weeks of the new year. >> the other thing, depending on where you stand, the idea that we just get rid of congressional approval of the debt ceili
he doesn't say maybe if we can't get a deal together, maybe we'd be okay with the fiscal cliff. he says that is the best deal for everyone, the best deal for progressives, just to do it. to go back to the clinton era rates. you get rid of three quarters of the deficit just on tax increases at that point. >> and he says you get defense cuts. >> you can't get defense cuts any other way. and he's not the only one. there's a lot of people on the left and there's quite a few people on...
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. >> with no breakthrough today, fiscal cliff negotiations, could this be a starting point? "outfront" republican congressman james lankford of oklahoma, incoming chairman of the republican policy committee, the fifth ranking position in the house gop leadership. appreciate you're taking the time. what about this idea of racing taxes on everyone? the math works much better. >> i heard your lead in when you said this is a new idea. actually, it's not a new idea, there are several democrats who have floated that for a while. the code word is we want to go back to the clinton tax rates and talk about the clinton economy that we had a much more vigorous economy and growth and we should go back to the clinton tax rates. what that really means is all tax rates on all americans go back up because the tax rates were brought down in 2001 and 2003. i don't support that. i don't think that's a great idea. it would slow down the economy. >> when you look at economist's evaluations, it would slow down the economy. it would. there's no question about it. but if the problem is that we have
. >> with no breakthrough today, fiscal cliff negotiations, could this be a starting point? "outfront" republican congressman james lankford of oklahoma, incoming chairman of the republican policy committee, the fifth ranking position in the house gop leadership. appreciate you're taking the time. what about this idea of racing taxes on everyone? the math works much better. >> i heard your lead in when you said this is a new idea. actually, it's not a new idea, there are...
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that were there when i was predz. >> with now break through today and the fiscal cliff negotiations, is this a starting point? "outfront" republican congressman james langford of oklahoma, incoming chairman of the republican policy committee, the fifth ranking position in the house gop leadership. good to see you, sir. appreciate you taking the time. what about this idea of raising taxes on everyone? the math actually in this case is much more promising. it works much better. >> right. i heard your lead-in on it, and you said this is a new idea floated by howard dean. ints a new idea. several democrats have floated that a while. the code word is going back to the clinton tax rates and talk about the clinton economy and we should go back to the clinton tax rates. what that means is all tax rates on all americans go back up because the tax rates were brought down in 2001 and 2003. so it's not new, and no, i don't support that. i don't think that's a great idea at all. it will slow down the economy. >> all right. the truth is when you look at economists' evaluations, it will slow down t
that were there when i was predz. >> with now break through today and the fiscal cliff negotiations, is this a starting point? "outfront" republican congressman james langford of oklahoma, incoming chairman of the republican policy committee, the fifth ranking position in the house gop leadership. good to see you, sir. appreciate you taking the time. what about this idea of raising taxes on everyone? the math actually in this case is much more promising. it works much better....
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who will blink first on the fiscal cliff? not the obama administration as timothy geithner told cnbc, bring it on. >> is the administration prepared to go over the fiscal cliff? >> absolutely. again, there's no prospect to an agreement that doesn't involve those rates going up on the top 2% of the wealthiest. >> taxpayers might think that's easy for geithner to say. what about all those middle class families whose tax will go up more than $2,000 if, as geithner suggests, we take a dive off that cliff? even though president obama and john boehner chatted on the phone, there's still no deal. republicans are not amused. >> incredibly, many top democrats, including the president, seem perfectly happy. perfectly happy to go off the cliff. that's why the president has been more interested in campaign rallies than actually negotiating a deal. >> many americans don't have much hope the two side also come up with a deal. they've moved on already to plan b. the retired teacher in utah has put off plans to get a new car. brian chandler,
who will blink first on the fiscal cliff? not the obama administration as timothy geithner told cnbc, bring it on. >> is the administration prepared to go over the fiscal cliff? >> absolutely. again, there's no prospect to an agreement that doesn't involve those rates going up on the top 2% of the wealthiest. >> taxpayers might think that's easy for geithner to say. what about all those middle class families whose tax will go up more than $2,000 if, as geithner suggests, we...
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fiscal cliff as a three-part problem. part one taxes. in the new year, taxes go up on everyone unless washington takes action. the government needs more money. president obama wants to get some of it from the top 2% of wage earners. he wants to raise their tax rate and limit how much they can deduct. the white house says this will bring in $1.6 trillion over ten years. >> that's what the american people have voted for. >> republicans say they'll agree to bring in more money, but not by raising tax rates. in fact, they want to lower tax rates for everyone. instead they'd raise money only by limits deductions and closing loopholes. speaker boehner says this will raise $800 billion over ten years. >> america faces a serious problem. our goal is to make sure it gets solved. >> step two, avoiding the drastic spending cuts that begin on january 1st, the so-called sequester. both sides want to find savings in medicare, but disagree about how to do it. >> we need a responsible white house. we can't sit here and negotiate with our
fiscal cliff as a three-part problem. part one taxes. in the new year, taxes go up on everyone unless washington takes action. the government needs more money. president obama wants to get some of it from the top 2% of wage earners. he wants to raise their tax rate and limit how much they can deduct. the white house says this will bring in $1.6 trillion over ten years. >> that's what the american people have voted for. >> republicans say they'll agree to bring in more money, but not...
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starbucks ceo has sobering advice to offer on the looming fiscal cliff, that the consequences will be far worse than last year's debt ceiling fight when the u.s. credit rating was downgraded for the first time ever. his message to lawmakers, now is not the time to play politics. it's about doing right by the american people. >> i think if people would get in the room and leave their ego behind, and not be so skewed towards the party but be so sensitive to the lens of the american people, we will have an agreement. >> poppy harlow is joining us with more. we've been talking about how this will affect us. schultz says this goes way beyond our boarders. >> it's global. something that stuck with me talking to him about this, the people who need a deal most will be hurt the most. here's why. >> this single issue has a seismic affect on the rest of the world, that we have never been as connected and the domino effect of a bad outcome here will have significant negative consequences, domestically and around the world, not the least of which will be the level -- the fracturing of confidence i
starbucks ceo has sobering advice to offer on the looming fiscal cliff, that the consequences will be far worse than last year's debt ceiling fight when the u.s. credit rating was downgraded for the first time ever. his message to lawmakers, now is not the time to play politics. it's about doing right by the american people. >> i think if people would get in the room and leave their ego behind, and not be so skewed towards the party but be so sensitive to the lens of the american people,...
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. >>> starbucks' ceo howard schultz has some sobering advice to offer on that looming fiscal cliff. he says consequences will be far worse than last year's debt ceiling fight, when the u.s. credit rating was downgraded for the first time ever. if a deal is not reached, he told our poppy harlow, the ripple effect will be felt worldwide. >> this single issue has a seismic effect on the rest of the world, that we have never been as connected and the domino effect of a bad outcome here will have significant negative consequences, domestically and around the world. >>> take a minute to come over to your tv, if you can. penn state has another pr problem on its hands this morning. the university's kai omega sorority is being investigated for stereotyping latinos after a picture showed up on the site tumblr. the photo showed sorority members wearing fake mustaches and dressed in somberos while holding signs that say, "i don't cut grass, i smoke it." the president of the chapter has apologized. is that enough, soledad? >> ladies, as your multi-ethnic friend, let me help you. help me help you
. >>> starbucks' ceo howard schultz has some sobering advice to offer on that looming fiscal cliff. he says consequences will be far worse than last year's debt ceiling fight, when the u.s. credit rating was downgraded for the first time ever. if a deal is not reached, he told our poppy harlow, the ripple effect will be felt worldwide. >> this single issue has a seismic effect on the rest of the world, that we have never been as connected and the domino effect of a bad outcome...
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. >> should there be a compromise in order to avoid going over the fiscal cliff? john boehner's already $800 billion in increased tax revenue, not necessarily raising the marginal tax rate on the wealthy, but capping deductions, limiting loopholes, are you with the speaker of the house on that? >> unfortunately, wolf, the policies of president obama have already taken us over the cliff. if you meet with businesses like i do all the time, they've already paired back plans for next year anticipating what's going to happen. we can fix this christmas eve if we want, but we've already hurt the economy and job growth. >> are you with boehner? >> i'm not with boehner. this government doesn't need anymore money. this country needs less government. we're going to have historic levels of revenue to the government this year. >> everyone's taxes are going up at the end of the year if there's no deal. >> we have already offered to extend current tax rates. that's what we should have done six months ago until we could come to some agreement, some compromise on tax reform. >> wh
. >> should there be a compromise in order to avoid going over the fiscal cliff? john boehner's already $800 billion in increased tax revenue, not necessarily raising the marginal tax rate on the wealthy, but capping deductions, limiting loopholes, are you with the speaker of the house on that? >> unfortunately, wolf, the policies of president obama have already taken us over the cliff. if you meet with businesses like i do all the time, they've already paired back plans for next...
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cliff unless both sides agree to raise rates on the wealthiest. that means raise tax rates for top earners. the reason that this is news is because there's been discussion publicly that perhaps they could find a rev new agreement where it would just involve capping deductions or maybe they could get to revenue just through tax reform, and with this piece of detail from that phone call yesterday, it would seem that the democrats, the president personally, is drawing a line saying those other ways are not enough. his campaign message that the top earners have to pay more, he is sticking to that line many these negotiations. >> jess, do we know how the republicans responded to this red line? >> well, speaker boehner was frustrated, wrovl, and came out with -- in his press conference today basically accusing the president of not leading on the issue. both sides are calling for the white house to come forward with spending cuts first, tell us where you are going to cut spending, before we, the republicans, will say whether we'll go along with you on ta
cliff unless both sides agree to raise rates on the wealthiest. that means raise tax rates for top earners. the reason that this is news is because there's been discussion publicly that perhaps they could find a rev new agreement where it would just involve capping deductions or maybe they could get to revenue just through tax reform, and with this piece of detail from that phone call yesterday, it would seem that the democrats, the president personally, is drawing a line saying those other...
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obama and the democrats get their way, doing the deal to avoid raising the rates and avoiding the fiscal cliff, where all tax cuts and brakes expire at the end of the year. that is an election, popular at the end of the year, certainly give president obama a lot of clout right now. you can disagree or agree with the policy. that is for you to decide. republican tom cole of oklahoma happens to disagree strongly. at the same time, he recognizes the political reality that all tax cuts will expire on january one, and no one wants to raise taxes on what would amount to 98% of all the taxpayers. >> in my view, we agree we're not going to raise taxes on people that make more than $250,000, we should just take them out of this discuss right now. continue to fight against any rate increases and continue to fight for a much bigger deal. >> congressman cole joins us, the staunchly conservative editorial page of "the wall street journal is on board now. president obama's re-election means that taxes for upper income earners are going up one way or another. the question is how republicans should hand
obama and the democrats get their way, doing the deal to avoid raising the rates and avoiding the fiscal cliff, where all tax cuts and brakes expire at the end of the year. that is an election, popular at the end of the year, certainly give president obama a lot of clout right now. you can disagree or agree with the policy. that is for you to decide. republican tom cole of oklahoma happens to disagree strongly. at the same time, he recognizes the political reality that all tax cuts will expire...
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obama and the democrats get their way, doing a deal to raise just those rates would avoid the fiscal cliff, where all bush era tax cuts on all tack tax brackets expire at the ends of the year. the election, popular opinion and more give president obama a lot of clout right now. and you can agree or disagree with the president's policy. that's for you to decide. republican congressmen tom cole of oklahoma disagrees stronsly. at the same time, he recognizes the political reality that all tax cuts will expire on january 1st and no one wants to raise taxes on what would amount to 98% of all taxpayers. >> in my view, we all agree that we're not going to raise taxes on people that make less than $250,000. we should just take them out of discussion right now. continue to fight against any rate increases, continue to try to work honestly for a much bigger deal. >> congressman cole joins us shortly. a rock rib conservative. chair of the national republican congressional committee, and he's no longer a lone voice in the wilderness. the staunchly conservative editorial page of "the wall street
obama and the democrats get their way, doing a deal to raise just those rates would avoid the fiscal cliff, where all bush era tax cuts on all tack tax brackets expire at the ends of the year. the election, popular opinion and more give president obama a lot of clout right now. and you can agree or disagree with the president's policy. that's for you to decide. republican congressmen tom cole of oklahoma disagrees stronsly. at the same time, he recognizes the political reality that all tax cuts...
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cliff. >> just 31 days until the deadline and our chief white house correspondent jessica yellin has more on where each side stands. >> randi, victor, democrats say tax rates have to raise on the wealthiest or there's no deal. but negotiations have to start with spending xuts. this is a case of who budges first. just when you thought campaign season was over -- >> if congress does nothing, every family in america will see their income taxes automatically go up on january 1st. >> president obama is back on the stump pressing republicans to cut a deal averting the fiscal cliff. >> that's sort of like the lump of coal you get for christmas. that's a scrooge christmas. >> reporter: republicans say they want their christmas, too, and blame the president for the deadlock. >> there's a stalemate. let's not kid ourselves. i'm not trying to make this more difficult. >> reporter: things got tense after treasury secretary geithner visited capitol hill thursday to present what republicans are calling an unreasonable proposal. it includes $1.6 trillion in new taxes. in part through raising rates
cliff. >> just 31 days until the deadline and our chief white house correspondent jessica yellin has more on where each side stands. >> randi, victor, democrats say tax rates have to raise on the wealthiest or there's no deal. but negotiations have to start with spending xuts. this is a case of who budges first. just when you thought campaign season was over -- >> if congress does nothing, every family in america will see their income taxes automatically go up on january 1st....
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known as the fiscal cliff. >> president obama is sending tim geithner to the hill today to meet with multiple congress ohhal leaders. i want to bring in senator john barrasso, republican from wyoming. senator, good to see you. good morning. >> thanks for having me. >> let's begin with something that's been reported on by the wall street journal. which is something we heard a couple days ago. the fact that the president now appears to be flexible when it comes to the top 2%. quote, president obama signalled he wouldn'tnsist tax rates on upper income americans rise to clinton era peaks as part of a deficit reduction deal. the white house's flexibility first described by democrat erskine bowles after meetings with mr. obama and others confirmed by administration officials could envision tax rates increase from their current levels but less than clinton era levels. would you agree to a deal, senator? call it in the middle. 37%. >> well, the problem with that is raising those tax rates on those folks really doesn't address the major problem which is the spending that's going on. >> let me
known as the fiscal cliff. >> president obama is sending tim geithner to the hill today to meet with multiple congress ohhal leaders. i want to bring in senator john barrasso, republican from wyoming. senator, good to see you. good morning. >> thanks for having me. >> let's begin with something that's been reported on by the wall street journal. which is something we heard a couple days ago. the fact that the president now appears to be flexible when it comes to the top 2%....
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insult and finger pointing in the fiscal cliff debate. tax rates spike and spending slashed. congress is breaking for the holidays in two weeks. it could send the economy spinning in directions. $1.6 trillion in tax hikes. he will travel to pennsylvania to sell it to you. republicans aren't buying it. listen to house speaker, john boehner. >> despite the claims the president supports a balanced approach, the democrats have yet to get serious about real spending cuts. >> democrats are firing right back at boehner. harry reid getting a little personal. >> i don't understand his brain, so you should ask him. okay? >> ouch. athena jones live from washington. same old same old. where do we go from here? >> that's the big question. the nice talk after the election is pretty much gone away. you mentioned one of the big sticking points, that's taxes. republicans and democrats can't agree on how to raise the tax revenue? end the bush tax cuts for the wealthy, close the loopholes, raise the capital gains taxes or all of the above. right now, they can't agree on how much money should be
insult and finger pointing in the fiscal cliff debate. tax rates spike and spending slashed. congress is breaking for the holidays in two weeks. it could send the economy spinning in directions. $1.6 trillion in tax hikes. he will travel to pennsylvania to sell it to you. republicans aren't buying it. listen to house speaker, john boehner. >> despite the claims the president supports a balanced approach, the democrats have yet to get serious about real spending cuts. >> democrats...
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let's talk about the fiscal cliff. the president says the republicans have to agree to raising the marginal tax rate for the wealthiest top 2% from 35%. does he mean it has to go back up to 39.6% as was the case during the clinton administration or is there some wiggle room in between 35% and 39.6%? >> the president has repeatedly said there's room for compromise. but what this boils down to is a matter of fairness and a matter of math. giving certainty to the middle class is essential. there's no way mathematically, if you look at the republican's proposal, that you can get to the deficit reduction that we need to with preserving the middle class tax cuts by not increasing as the republicans refuse to do the upper tier rates. there's room for discussion, but that -- >> so the 39.6%, that's not a red line? >> as far as i know and the conversations i've had, the president has said there's room for compromise, but for the red line to be drawn in the sand by republicans to say that an increase in rates on the wealthiest a
let's talk about the fiscal cliff. the president says the republicans have to agree to raising the marginal tax rate for the wealthiest top 2% from 35%. does he mean it has to go back up to 39.6% as was the case during the clinton administration or is there some wiggle room in between 35% and 39.6%? >> the president has repeatedly said there's room for compromise. but what this boils down to is a matter of fairness and a matter of math. giving certainty to the middle class is essential....
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called the fiscal split or the fiscal cliff because president obama's plan to avoid the fiscal cliff is not exactly flying with republicans. 32 days now count with me 32 tax rates soar, spending cuts automatically kick in and keep in mind there is a date that we're watching also before this, congress break for the holidays in all of 14 days. >> so to review the president's plan calls for $1.6 trillion in tax hikes, $50 billion in new stimulus spending, and $400 billion in unspecified cuts. the president for himself he's heading to a manufacturing plant in pennsylvania today to try to sell that idea. house speaker john boehner's reaction was essentially, get serious. so we want to talk about the numbers behind this. we're going to bring in ken rogoff, professor of economics and public policy at harvard university. you heard the specifics of the plan, $1.6 trillion in new taxes, $400 billion in unspecified cuts, $50 billion in new stimulus. how does this sound to you? >> well, it certainly sounds like a plan. and i do think we have to see some mix of higher revenues starting now and fr
called the fiscal split or the fiscal cliff because president obama's plan to avoid the fiscal cliff is not exactly flying with republicans. 32 days now count with me 32 tax rates soar, spending cuts automatically kick in and keep in mind there is a date that we're watching also before this, congress break for the holidays in all of 14 days. >> so to review the president's plan calls for $1.6 trillion in tax hikes, $50 billion in new stimulus spending, and $400 billion in unspecified...
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this is a so-called fiscal cliff. january 1st. our news makers representative jim clyburn of south carolina, number three democrat in the house of representatives and number one i'm sure to a lot of people. hello. how are you? >> hey, don. thank you so much for having me. >> thanks for coming on. is speaker boehner right, though? as the clock is ticking, ticking toward january 1st, the talks haven't progressed in two weeks. is he right? >> well, i don't know that i'm as disappointed as the speaker is right now. i understand some of his problem with this. but the fact of the matter is the american people ended elections on november 6th, voiced their approval of president obama's approach to this. over 3 million more people voted for him than voted for mr. romney. and then if you look at house democr democrats. only 201 of us got eelected. that means the rest were republicans. >> i understand that. >> but over 500,000 more votes than they got -- >> with all due respect, representative, we understand that the president won and you fe
this is a so-called fiscal cliff. january 1st. our news makers representative jim clyburn of south carolina, number three democrat in the house of representatives and number one i'm sure to a lot of people. hello. how are you? >> hey, don. thank you so much for having me. >> thanks for coming on. is speaker boehner right, though? as the clock is ticking, ticking toward january 1st, the talks haven't progressed in two weeks. is he right? >> well, i don't know that i'm as...
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cliff, that difference between tax rates for the wealthiest americans. and what house democrats announced they're going to try to do is an end run around the house gop to try to file a petition in order to try to push a vote on the house floor to just raise taxes -- excuse me, to just extend the bush-era tax rates for middle class americans. but to do that, as you know, they need 218 votes and there's still a very sizable republican majority in the house. it will be difficult for democrats to do that. >> absolutely. and that proposal to take away what has been historically a congressional prerogative was a little bit surprising even to people who have been reading about this stuff for years. is it true though, dana, as it has been in past years that both sides at least have to show their bases that they're fighting the good fight and that's part of what's going on here? >> reporter: absolutely. there's no question about it. what i mention in the piece really is a real phenomenon here when it comes to the feeling among congressional democrats that they ar
cliff, that difference between tax rates for the wealthiest americans. and what house democrats announced they're going to try to do is an end run around the house gop to try to file a petition in order to try to push a vote on the house floor to just raise taxes -- excuse me, to just extend the bush-era tax rates for middle class americans. but to do that, as you know, they need 218 votes and there's still a very sizable republican majority in the house. it will be difficult for democrats to...
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on the fiscal cliff. >> how does it play into fiscal cliff negotiation? >> you would think it gives them a sobering sense of if we do the right thing, maybe the economy keeps growing, if we do the wrong thing, might tip the united states. some think even the possibility of another global recession. you would think it would be a motivation to get things done. if you listen to what's said publicly, see if they're working out a deal privately, there are staff level conversations but most of the big voices dug in. >> you had a fascinating interview with the head of the international monitoring fund, it will air sunday on "state of the union." let me play a clip. what happens in fiscal cliff negotiations in washington could have a huge impact around the world. >> there's still that degree of uncertainty that fuels doubt, that prevents investors, entrepreneurs, households from making decisions because they don't know what tomorrow will be. they know that a fix has been found for today but there is still work to be done tomorrow and day after tomorrow. so it wou
on the fiscal cliff. >> how does it play into fiscal cliff negotiation? >> you would think it gives them a sobering sense of if we do the right thing, maybe the economy keeps growing, if we do the wrong thing, might tip the united states. some think even the possibility of another global recession. you would think it would be a motivation to get things done. if you listen to what's said publicly, see if they're working out a deal privately, there are staff level conversations but...
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Dec 4, 2012
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. >>> back to our conversation on the so-called fiscal cliff. the debt reducing tax hikes and federal spending cuts coming january 1st unless congress and the president act. so now both sides have offers on the table, the democrats' plan which would focus debt reduction on higher tax rates for the wealthiest 2%. house republicans, they anted up yesterday with a plan to cut the debt through tax code and spending reforms, not through higher tax rates for the wealthy. if there is no agreement, you know the deal, everyone, everyone's taxes go up. representative tom price of georgia joins me now from capitol hill. he is a hard line republican. congressman, good to see you. thanks for coming on. >> yes, thank you so much. good to be with you. >> the republican plan published yesterday, it is note worthry, congressman price, it would raise more money through the tax system this and is a pretty big departure for your republican party. i just want to know, do you support this proposal put forward by the speaker of the house? >> well, this proposal is jus
. >>> back to our conversation on the so-called fiscal cliff. the debt reducing tax hikes and federal spending cuts coming january 1st unless congress and the president act. so now both sides have offers on the table, the democrats' plan which would focus debt reduction on higher tax rates for the wealthiest 2%. house republicans, they anted up yesterday with a plan to cut the debt through tax code and spending reforms, not through higher tax rates for the wealthy. if there is no...
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Nov 30, 2012
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of course, if the fiscal cliff does come to be and the economy slows or dips back into recession, things will really slow down. what automakers are doing is continuing to push the sales of smaller cars, which is what the public wants, because tgas prics are rising. sales of these types of vehicles do real well in places like california where people drive long distances and where a lot of people are very concerned about the environment and want to drive hybrid or electric vehicles. so even though they haven't been so strong throughout the rest of the country, companies like general motors continue to push ahead with these vehicles. here is their newest introduction, which will be on the market in 2014. only available for sale in california and in oregon initially. this is the chevy spark. it is an all electric vehicle that will get somewhere south of 100 miles on a full charge. what's really cool about this vehicle is you'll be able to charge it up to 80% capacity in just 20 minutes. that is a challenge, though, getting the rest of america outside of places like california to buy these ve
of course, if the fiscal cliff does come to be and the economy slows or dips back into recession, things will really slow down. what automakers are doing is continuing to push the sales of smaller cars, which is what the public wants, because tgas prics are rising. sales of these types of vehicles do real well in places like california where people drive long distances and where a lot of people are very concerned about the environment and want to drive hybrid or electric vehicles. so even...
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. >> well, nobody wants anyone to go off the fiscal cliff. and the reality is we have to look over the last two years. the republican party established themselves as the party that was willing to let americans entire credit rating go down the tubes in order to stop barack obama last year. it's very clear that most people are going to see them as being the party that's being more obstinate. the truth of the matter is they also because they lost so badly in the election, nobody wants to be seen playing footsie with barack obama under the table which is what they're going to have to do to get this deal done. the republican party is going tond up being blamed which is one of the reasons they will have to compromise more. it's the same thing the democrats did when bush won. you have to compromise with the party that just won. jason johnson, john brabender, thank you thank you both. >>> the new york film critics have made their choices for top films and many times they end up as oscar favorites. all the details next. all the details next. we are ga
. >> well, nobody wants anyone to go off the fiscal cliff. and the reality is we have to look over the last two years. the republican party established themselves as the party that was willing to let americans entire credit rating go down the tubes in order to stop barack obama last year. it's very clear that most people are going to see them as being the party that's being more obstinate. the truth of the matter is they also because they lost so badly in the election, nobody wants to be...
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Nov 29, 2012
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so until the republicans agree to those clinton-era rates, we are going to go off the fiscal cliff. >> you know, it's interesting, ari, you'll remember this because you were the white house press secretary in 2001 and 2003 when those bush-era tax rates were approved basically by republicans, very few democrats voted to approve those bush-era tax cuts. so why not do what the republican congressman from oklahoma says, what paul just said, go ahead, declare victory. say, look, all these democrats are now on board, they support for 98% of the american people the bush-era tax rates for a long time to come, declare victory and move on. >> well, number one, wolf, actually those tax cuts were bipartisan. 12 senators -- democratic senators voted for them, a good number. more than 60 senators voted for the bush tax cuts across the board. number two, let me surprise you with this, i don't agree by going over the fiscal cliff, but i do agree that the smart move for the americans to make they don't have leverage on the taxes. the payroll tax cut about to expire and it did expire, republicans tucke
so until the republicans agree to those clinton-era rates, we are going to go off the fiscal cliff. >> you know, it's interesting, ari, you'll remember this because you were the white house press secretary in 2001 and 2003 when those bush-era tax rates were approved basically by republicans, very few democrats voted to approve those bush-era tax cuts. so why not do what the republican congressman from oklahoma says, what paul just said, go ahead, declare victory. say, look, all these...
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Dec 3, 2012
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if we go off the fiscal cliff and congress doesn't take any action to soften the blow, tax rates will go up quite a lot on dividends, from 15% to more than 40% in most circumstances. there are economists who think that will have a big impact on stock markets and they could go down 10%, maybe 20%. i do not think those effects are as strong as some economists believe. i think it is something the market could get over. you're in a long term tax and vanished savings situation. i think you are basically going to be fine unless you're planning on retiring release soon. i do think that is something you have to keep in mind. diversification out of the assets that are most affected by these kinds of taxes is probably never a bad idea. host: john mckinnon is a reporter for "the wall street journal." he is now in the washington bureau. he was a columnist for "the miami herald." what sectors would be hit harder if deductions and loopholes or taken out of the tax code? guest: the stocks that pay a high dividend. these tend to be utility stocks. there are lots of old, established, u.s. industrial f
if we go off the fiscal cliff and congress doesn't take any action to soften the blow, tax rates will go up quite a lot on dividends, from 15% to more than 40% in most circumstances. there are economists who think that will have a big impact on stock markets and they could go down 10%, maybe 20%. i do not think those effects are as strong as some economists believe. i think it is something the market could get over. you're in a long term tax and vanished savings situation. i think you are...
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fiscal cliff? guest: if we go off the cliff, the rate will go up to 39.6%. the low bracket will go away and the lowest tax bracket will be 15% if we go off the cliff. 15% to 39.6% if we go off the cliff. caller: what about the other rates? host: we have a question on twitter. guest: you don't pay taxes on losses. a you're making profits and picture up over $250,000, that could result in a tax increase that kicks you over $250,000. caller: we need jobs in this country. i hear all this money being talked. the average worker -- i am lucky i get 30 hours. they're cutting down to 20 hours at wal-mart. i had a good manager. i notice a woman comes in. she says we can get anybody to work. you talk about the tax credits. most of us have no chance of getting anything like that. this is too low republicans and democrats. fascism and communism, it was always party first. that's what our country has come to. we have to come together as true conservatives and true democrats and come together. guest: one of the b
fiscal cliff? guest: if we go off the cliff, the rate will go up to 39.6%. the low bracket will go away and the lowest tax bracket will be 15% if we go off the cliff. 15% to 39.6% if we go off the cliff. caller: what about the other rates? host: we have a question on twitter. guest: you don't pay taxes on losses. a you're making profits and picture up over $250,000, that could result in a tax increase that kicks you over $250,000. caller: we need jobs in this country. i hear all this money...
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that's the first part of the fiscal cliff. the second part of it is the spending decrease that this congress and the president agreed to the last summer to say we dramatically increase spending, we have to reduce that spending. that spending decrease that was agreed to had a deadline by the end of this year. if there didn't there would be across the board cuts. the house passed our spending decreases in may. the senate has yet to pass any. with that we're stuck with across-the-board cuts that will be in early january. and the tax rate for all americans. in 2001 and 2003 and then extended during the lame duck of 2010, every americans' tax rates were extended out to expire the 31st of december. every tax rate from the lowest to the highest is set to go up. some people see the problem is we're not taxing enough and so that solves the problem. to just go off the fiscal cliff and everyone will be taxed more. some say we don't take from some group and give to the other. some say go to the clinton tax rate. we had a booming economy a
that's the first part of the fiscal cliff. the second part of it is the spending decrease that this congress and the president agreed to the last summer to say we dramatically increase spending, we have to reduce that spending. that spending decrease that was agreed to had a deadline by the end of this year. if there didn't there would be across the board cuts. the house passed our spending decreases in may. the senate has yet to pass any. with that we're stuck with across-the-board cuts that...
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i believe we can avoid the fiscal cliff and address our massive deficit but that requires doing three essential things: reforming our tax code, reforming entitlement programs, and better controlling our spending. we can get additional revenue by reforming our tax code. that means closing loopholes and limiting deductions. by closing loopholes and limiting deductions, we can make the tax code -- tax code simpler and fairer to stimulate growth in our economy. markets get the kind of certainty they need to invest, to grow and to hire. it's a growing economy, a growing economic base that creates more jobs and revenue, not higher taxes. the simple fact is, we must make america a great place to do business again. our pro-growth strategies in my home state of north dakota have broadened our economic base and raised revenue without raising taxes. that has resulted in the lowest unemployment rate in the nation. growing personal income and rather than a deficit, a budget surplus. in addition to pro-growth tax reform, we also need to start a fair and thoughtful process to reform entitlement prog
i believe we can avoid the fiscal cliff and address our massive deficit but that requires doing three essential things: reforming our tax code, reforming entitlement programs, and better controlling our spending. we can get additional revenue by reforming our tax code. that means closing loopholes and limiting deductions. by closing loopholes and limiting deductions, we can make the tax code -- tax code simpler and fairer to stimulate growth in our economy. markets get the kind of certainty...
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Nov 29, 2012
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well, the easiest way to end the uncertainty about the fiscal cliff and tax rates and their potential impact of the vast majority of americans as they go into this vital holiday shopping season that's pretty central to our economy is for us to pass that and say okay, that part of this is over. the $2,000 on average tax hike that most working families are facing, if we go over the cliff done, taken care of. now, let's work through the balance of increased revenue on the high income earners and spending cuts that we need to get done to achieve a roughly $4 trillion savings. >> bill: and closing loopholes and other issues. >> that's a difficult process. there's lots of detail to it. in my view, there's two bad outcomes here that are quite possible. first is we do nothing. which is -- something we seem to have shown some real capability of. but if we go over the if is cal cliff, which is really more of a slope than a cliff. it is not like y2k where january 1, everybody has a dramatic cuts in services and dramatic increases in taxes. that will smooth in over time. that will happen over som
well, the easiest way to end the uncertainty about the fiscal cliff and tax rates and their potential impact of the vast majority of americans as they go into this vital holiday shopping season that's pretty central to our economy is for us to pass that and say okay, that part of this is over. the $2,000 on average tax hike that most working families are facing, if we go over the cliff done, taken care of. now, let's work through the balance of increased revenue on the high income earners and...
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and you know, there are some taxes that would go up if we two off the fiscal cliff. you're talking about a family that makes about $50,000 having a tax increase of $4,000. melissa: congresswoman, this drives me crazy. when we look at all the numbers we immediately start taing about taxes. it seems like we're looking for revenue under every single rock. that's fine. even if we raised taxes that are proposed by the white house, it will raise $82 billion. it is one half of 1% of the problem. have a $16.3 trillion debt. all of this talk about raising taxes doesn't get us even close to solving the problem. it doesn't even start the conversation. it is not a drop in the bucket. we've got to reform our spending or grow the economy. but just raising taxes isn't going to do it. >> well, i agree with you 100%. that's why the president as well as the democrats have called for a balanced approach. so of course we can't raise enough taxes to completely deal witthe deficit. and you do have to do reforms. you need to reform the tax system. you certainly need to make additional cuts
and you know, there are some taxes that would go up if we two off the fiscal cliff. you're talking about a family that makes about $50,000 having a tax increase of $4,000. melissa: congresswoman, this drives me crazy. when we look at all the numbers we immediately start taing about taxes. it seems like we're looking for revenue under every single rock. that's fine. even if we raised taxes that are proposed by the white house, it will raise $82 billion. it is one half of 1% of the problem. have...
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we are distracted by the fiscal cliff. let there be a economic growth. interest rates would go up. interest rates will stay reasonably low. we should be glad that we have this economy. either we really go down the cliff or let some growth kick in and indeeddwhat happens, interest rates will go up. ultimately, inflation is the road we will be heading on. dagen: is there anything you can look at today that shows interest rates will go up? >> what we know now is that the federal reserve no longer focuses on inflation, but on employment. that is why the unemployment rate will be ever more important today. next year, the federal reserve will be even more starvation -- we are going to push growth at any cost: the cost being inflation. at some point, the market will take point. we are going to have a lot of turmoil. we do not have a european crisis. we are certainly a candidate. higher rates will be in it. dagen: higher by how much quick select you have 1.6% on the ten year period >> in recent years, everyone has felt warm and fuzzy. let volatility go back to normal time. you do not need
we are distracted by the fiscal cliff. let there be a economic growth. interest rates would go up. interest rates will stay reasonably low. we should be glad that we have this economy. either we really go down the cliff or let some growth kick in and indeeddwhat happens, interest rates will go up. ultimately, inflation is the road we will be heading on. dagen: is there anything you can look at today that shows interest rates will go up? >> what we know now is that the federal reserve no...
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Nov 30, 2012
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both sides sticking to party lines refusing to budge on the fiscal cliff. we will break through the gridlock on the last day of our special series fiscal cliff survival kits. david dietz from another taken. dennis: what your small business needs to do to prepare for falling off of the cliff. cheryl: in all of this is a silver lining especially dividend payouts and stimulus payoffs. dennis: a push to replace the paper dollar with a coin. won't believe how much money for taxpayers. cheryl: lauren simonetti in the stock exchange. >> the nasdaq anderson be a higher but not for the dow. the dow is negative but the other two are positive. the second week in a row, all three indices are down right now and near session lows, relatively flat, major declines, and major comments out of anybody in washington regarding the fiscal cliff today so we have this cautious market. let's look at the biggest loser in the s&p 500, cabarrus 9. shares are tanking 14%. they operate diaz they.com internet addresses, they renewed contract with regulators but as part of the deal they c
both sides sticking to party lines refusing to budge on the fiscal cliff. we will break through the gridlock on the last day of our special series fiscal cliff survival kits. david dietz from another taken. dennis: what your small business needs to do to prepare for falling off of the cliff. cheryl: in all of this is a silver lining especially dividend payouts and stimulus payoffs. dennis: a push to replace the paper dollar with a coin. won't believe how much money for taxpayers. cheryl: lauren...
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i think without the fiscal cliff, we will do all right. lori: tax rates or than likely are going up, at least for one class. you have this slow growth. at the same time, think of the federal reserve keeping rates low for so long. we could be in serious trouble. >> on the inflation front, we are not very worried for the next year or two. it is out there, but not the next year or two. they will phase in whatever tax increase they put in. it will not hit next year. it will phase in over a couple years. that is the smart way to do it. lori: thank you for your time. >> thank you. you bet. melissa: i would like to be optimistic. date -- details of the probe have not been released. over 80 people have already been questioned about the more than $5 billion in trading losses last day. peter barnes has the exquisite details right now. peter: we first learned about this probe in september through news media reports. the number of people questioned suggest that the scope of this thing is broad and could lead to more political problems in washington fo
i think without the fiscal cliff, we will do all right. lori: tax rates or than likely are going up, at least for one class. you have this slow growth. at the same time, think of the federal reserve keeping rates low for so long. we could be in serious trouble. >> on the inflation front, we are not very worried for the next year or two. it is out there, but not the next year or two. they will phase in whatever tax increase they put in. it will not hit next year. it will phase in over a...
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the managing partner of mortgage banking solutions joins me from austin, texas with his fiscal cliff survival tips. thank you for being with us on our series this week. you say we are thinking of buying a home right now we should do it. why? >> interest rates at the lowest, affordability index at the highest, great time to buy, people are buying and we're seeing bottom form because of investors' coming in and picking the property, that has been displaced, get in and buy now, you not see this for decades. cheryl: i will lose mortgage interest deduction, there is talk about loopholes like primary properties, and you can sell it with no taxes paid with the rollover or not and changing that as well. that is negative for housing. >> they are losing that incentive, the tax incentive in the refund each month. when that goes away there's one more incentive to let go of that house when things get tight but here is the upside and this is why i recommend people look at this. the inflation component is going to kick in, they will go back up. it is and appreciation -- cheryl: we are talking about
the managing partner of mortgage banking solutions joins me from austin, texas with his fiscal cliff survival tips. thank you for being with us on our series this week. you say we are thinking of buying a home right now we should do it. why? >> interest rates at the lowest, affordability index at the highest, great time to buy, people are buying and we're seeing bottom form because of investors' coming in and picking the property, that has been displaced, get in and buy now, you not see...
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goes over that fiscal cliff, people in california will pay a ton in extra taxes. california would have the highest earners there would pay almost 52% as their marginal income tax rate. the highest in the country. the only state that would have a calculated rate would be hawaii. three percentage points to the marginal state income tax rate. we will have entrepreneur ethan anderson coming up, maybe tomorrow, to talk about what that does for business. connell: the tax man is for amazon. the irs calling for back taxes after accusing the company of avoiding billions of dollars of taxes in the united states and europe. the accusations, after amazon bought a home in luxembourg and channeled their sales through it in order to create a tax shelter for the american and european governments. the stock by $0.24. dagen: make sure to wash your hands before you check out. according to a new survey, 16% of online holiday shopping is conducted on the pot. from the toilet. in the john. more than 38 million adults admit to shopping with their pants around their ankles. the study did
goes over that fiscal cliff, people in california will pay a ton in extra taxes. california would have the highest earners there would pay almost 52% as their marginal income tax rate. the highest in the country. the only state that would have a calculated rate would be hawaii. three percentage points to the marginal state income tax rate. we will have entrepreneur ethan anderson coming up, maybe tomorrow, to talk about what that does for business. connell: the tax man is for amazon. the irs...
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Nov 30, 2012
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if you raise rate on two top brackets how much does it bring in? it brings in '82 billion. guess how much in terms of government spending in term of time frame it covers, a month, a year? ashley: five minutes? >> pretty close, ashley. look at this. ashley: what is it? >> covers 1 1/2 weeks of government spending at current rates. ashley: that's it. >> when we talk about the fair share, tracy and ashley, you never hear the president say this what the top 1% pay. in other words what their fair share. look at this, 37% of the top 1% is responsible for in terms of personal income tax revenue. they pay, they earn just one fifth, just one fifth of adjusted gross income. moving along top 5%, nearly 60% of the personal income tax revenue. ashley: comes from the top 5%. >> top five%. they earn a third of adjusted gross income. top 10% pay 71%. tracy: who are these people? who is the break down. >> talking about upper brackets. ashley: top 10% of earners in this country pay 70% of the federal taxes? >> that's right. so they make about 45% of the income. the issue too is, you heard ta
if you raise rate on two top brackets how much does it bring in? it brings in '82 billion. guess how much in terms of government spending in term of time frame it covers, a month, a year? ashley: five minutes? >> pretty close, ashley. look at this. ashley: what is it? >> covers 1 1/2 weeks of government spending at current rates. ashley: that's it. >> when we talk about the fair share, tracy and ashley, you never hear the president say this what the top 1% pay. in other words...
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Dec 6, 2012
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. >> if is the administration prepared too go over the fiscal cliff. >> absolutely. there is no prospect to an agreement that doesn't involve those rates going up on the top 2% of the wealthist, remember it's only 2%. >> he did not blink. that is the treasury secretary. do they talk like that? >> it's really unique. this treasury secretary is very loyal to this president, treasury secretaries are, but he is saying essentially that the tax rates going up are essential, that the money is not essential, that the dollar figure is not essential, that the rates going up are essential, and that's just interesting. going over the cliff comes with a lot of -- a lot of things that could affect the economy and the treasury secretary knows that. bill: 10% unemployment. tax rates for everybody going higher. what are you hearing on the house side? among the house republicans, whether or not they are behind the speaker, whether they are pulling away from him, where does that stand do you believe? >> reporter: you know, there are some on the house side that have a lot of concerns ab
. >> if is the administration prepared too go over the fiscal cliff. >> absolutely. there is no prospect to an agreement that doesn't involve those rates going up on the top 2% of the wealthist, remember it's only 2%. >> he did not blink. that is the treasury secretary. do they talk like that? >> it's really unique. this treasury secretary is very loyal to this president, treasury secretaries are, but he is saying essentially that the tax rates going up are essential,...
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the top senate democrats said they won't consider proposals to saw void the so-called fiscal cliff. not until the gop agrees that tax rates will go up on the wealthiest of americans. they said it from the beginning. president obama visited a family in virginia to layout his case. the white house says it is one of thousands of middle class families facing higher taxes if congress doesn't reach some sort of deal. house speaker insists the republicans will not go along with a higher tax rate for anybody, but an incrowsing number of republicans -- an increasing number of republicans are saying they will have to give in to democrats' demands. you know i read a number of websites that said republicans have waived the white flag on some issues, but not all of them. assuring republicans they don't have to vote for a tax increase. >> and it technically may be correct, but not many are buying this new strategy from the white house since the tax cuts from the middle class and those from the top 2% are both set to expire at the end of the year. the white house says congress really only has to e
the top senate democrats said they won't consider proposals to saw void the so-called fiscal cliff. not until the gop agrees that tax rates will go up on the wealthiest of americans. they said it from the beginning. president obama visited a family in virginia to layout his case. the white house says it is one of thousands of middle class families facing higher taxes if congress doesn't reach some sort of deal. house speaker insists the republicans will not go along with a higher tax rate for...
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president obama saying now a deal to avoid the so-called fiscal cliff could be about a week away. there is just one catch. he says republicans have to accept the, quote: reality as he puts it that tax rates are going up for the richest americans. something g.o.p. leaders are calling a deal breaker. >> we're not insisting on rates just out of spite or out of any kind of partisan bickering. but rather because we need to raise a certain amount of revenue. we can probably solve this. it's not that tough. but we need that conceptual break through that says we need to do a balanced plan. >> we made a good faith offer to avert the fiscal crisis and that offer included significant spending cuts reforms and it included additional revenue. and frankly, it was a balanced approach mr. president has been asking for. now we need a response from the white house. >> they have 27 days to prevent automatic tax hikes and spending cuts from kicking in on new year's day. ed henry live at the white house for us. ed, we are hearing the president and house speaker john boehner actually talked by phone no
president obama saying now a deal to avoid the so-called fiscal cliff could be about a week away. there is just one catch. he says republicans have to accept the, quote: reality as he puts it that tax rates are going up for the richest americans. something g.o.p. leaders are calling a deal breaker. >> we're not insisting on rates just out of spite or out of any kind of partisan bickering. but rather because we need to raise a certain amount of revenue. we can probably solve this. it's not...
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. >> reporter: secretary geithner said he cannot promise we will not go over the fiscal cliff and whether or not we go over it depends -- is a decision, rather, that lay in the hands of republicans that don't want to increase tax rates. speaker boehner said there is a chance we go over the cliff, but he doesn't want any part of that and he will do everything he can to avert that. eric, jamie? >> eric: peter, negotiations if and when they commence and continue, we'll see what happens. thank you, peter. jamie? >> jamie: well, you will also want -- we're going to talk, actually, to chris wallace and get a preview about that interview. hard to believe he has both tim geithner and john boehner. from the looks of it, john boehner does seem to be flabbergasted. we'll get to that shortly. >> eric: that is on "fox news sunday." later today, exclusive interview with speaker boehner. sunday at 2:00 p.m. and 6:00 p.m. right here on the fox news channel. >> jamie: well, there is a push by the senate republican leader mitch mcconnell as well to put medicare and social security on the table to try and t
. >> reporter: secretary geithner said he cannot promise we will not go over the fiscal cliff and whether or not we go over it depends -- is a decision, rather, that lay in the hands of republicans that don't want to increase tax rates. speaker boehner said there is a chance we go over the cliff, but he doesn't want any part of that and he will do everything he can to avert that. eric, jamie? >> eric: peter, negotiations if and when they commence and continue, we'll see what...